From goffmac747@aol.com Sat Feb 09 03:09:49 2013
Subject:Re: OT: Leslie louvers vs. slots
Do you mean 99% of the players or the listeners? If its the listener, I've always had a problem with that mode of thinking. An 860 is already a departure from the classic Leslie. The rotor is slanted only to compress the cabinet size so the doppler on that is unusual vs. a normal top rotor sitting level with the shelf. And there is minimal to none cabinet tone from that small compact cabinet which has tolex on it anyway, like putting tolex on the spruce top of your Martin 000-18. It seems to me that when they made these pro series leslies it was all about volume and anvil case-itude and classic leslie tones got left on the designer floor..I have not seen a pro series in a pro concert with the exception of maybe greenspoon in the TDN days and lately afik he's back to classic cabinets. I'm, sure there are many older bands and clips of them using these pro series style with the "let's make the sides look like a fender grill cloth treatment" look..but boss how about the louvers??... ahh just cut a large hole, puffs on his cigar....but this is beside the point..its all to taste but as with anything there is a standard and the departure from that standard...i used to salivate after a 900 series back in the day and before I built my road 142 I wanted an 860 for gigs as well..but learning to use a classic cabinet is an art form we need to keep alive. ironic that what Laurens hated became his nemesis. and then it has become classic cab vs. whatubrung which ends up being a stylized approach..
Even tho Japan is notorious for making things cheaper, at least it has due respect for the classic ways of doing things, they are still taking pains to retain that sentiment:
http://www.production-room.com/gfx/products/large/2103.gif
http://www.musik-meisinger.de/1/images/Leslie%202103%20mk2(back).jpg
g/
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Dockrill
To: CloneWheel
Sent: Sat, Feb 9, 2013 9:27 am
Subject: Re: [CWSG] OT: Leslie louvers vs. slots
probably true but 99.9% wouldn't know the difference, I cut the top back out of my 860 and run open backed on my other 2.
________________________________
From: Goff goffmac747@aol.com>
To: CloneWheel@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, February 8, 2013 7:02:52 PM
Subject: Re: [CWSG] OT: Leslie louvers vs. slots
If that suits your taste, why not. But because the rear is usually mic'd doesn't mean the original louvers won't produce a different sound. Not all recordings are the mics stuffed into the rotor cavities. There are distance mic'd tracks to get the sound of the entire Leslie working its magic. All the pro concerts I've worked on mic the rear but face the louvers to the player. And the riders are always for the classic 122 or 147, never a solid state model. You could try mic'ing the louvers and do an A/B between the rear and the louvers. Perhaps an ear can't detect a difference but a mic can. Then let someone else with different ears listen to the comparison along with you. Real louvers have a subdued tone compared to no louvers out the back. Then there is still the issue that the sound of both the louvers and the rear are mixing together. You'll notice the rear covers are louvered only on the bottom but a solid piece up top with a length of sound
absorbent material on the inside of the top rear cover. I've heard of some covering the louvers and allowing the sound only out the rear. I would imagine that if taking the extra time to route out louvers were considered a waste, the factory would've given up on doing them. There are those that can tell there's a difference and know how to use the louvers to get a tone. In fact some go to an extreme and knock on the louvers checking for a certain resonance in choosing a cabinet. The sound of the cabinet also makes for tone so using the whole system while playing is extremely useful rather than blasting on 10 and just listening to rotors. I would say that the evolution of Leslie for rock stage use back in the days when PA's were a stack of A7's was all about how loud the Leslie could get on stage but that's all changed now and subtlety is now possible with superior mains and monitor systems.
A good example of expert subtle use is the Hammond track on Believe by Brooks and Dunn.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9-FQMxO_-Q
G/
-----Original Message-----
From: j a hammond321@yahoo.com>
To: clonewheel clonewheel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Feb 9, 2013 6:10 am
Subject: [CWSG] OT: Leslie louvers vs. slots
Going back a bit to an earlier thread there was some discussion about the sound emanating through louvered vents on a Leslie cabinet (a 122 for example) vs. rectangular slots (a 760 or Frankenleslie for example). I thought about that a bit and realized that almost every Leslie I've ever played was turned around backwards with the rear top panel and lower louver panel removed so it would be louder and could be mic'd if needed.
I never noticed any difference in sound between that configuration and listening to one in its factory state.
I don't think it really makes much difference one way or the other, and probably wouldn't be worth the extra trouble trying to get the louvers exactly right.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]