From mskremote@yahoo.com Mon Apr 23 04:29:01 2012
Subject:Re: V-Machines that didn't work for me,
Hi Bruce,
With respect your OP stated that "laptop rugged won't cut it" and then listed the reasons why - screen, HDD, anti-virus etc. Sentiments that have been echoed by others here and when reinforced by a respected engineer and player as I understand you to be carry some weight.
As WW (which I assume is everyone who plays for reward and also has day job) with limited funds and wanting to upgrade my gig rig and tones I chose to go down the laptop/VST path. I looked at the options, Nord Stage etc. and the Muse Receptor. When I read the specs for the Muse Receptor 2 + which offers 750 Gig HDD (not SSD), 4 gig RAM (DDR 2 not 3) and a dual Core AMD processor for $1,900 I figured that configuation is equal to an entry level laptop which new would sell for less than half that price. I did some research and found that many VST's are still 32 bit and lot of people reporting issues running 32 bit VST's in 64 bit OS's. So I chose to go with 32 bit OS as currently all 64 bit VST's are available as 32 bit versions.
As both the laptop and the Muse use HDD's they are both equally prone to all the supposed reliability issues that affect HDD's.
I agree setting up a gig ready Windows PC is a "roll your own" project. A few more steps than achieving the same outcome on a Mac. On both you have to load 3rd party software to host the selected VST's (or AU's) to get the required functionality. Installing and setting up was straight forward up in my experience. Fine tuning the VST's on screen I find much more user friendly than menu-diving.
As previously stated I have more sucess using the laptop VST solution than I at first expected. The constant evolution of processors, RAM and HDD/SSD storage means that almost any current laptop or netbook can comfortably run well written VST's (and Guido's achievement in coding to make VB3 use so little machine resources is equally as impressive as the sound itself). By comparison I found the NI Kontak player and Vintage Organs to be very demanding on system resources and have chosen not to use them on my live machine.
My point in responding is to make other WW's with limited funds aware that laptops or netbooks are now a low cost viable, reliable and giggable option. There are so many free and low cost VST's available that should suit almost anyones taste. Your ideal solution would be better but while we wait what is available to use today is fine. As for the rigours of gigging there is always the option of mounting the laptop in a rack (some pro's do this now), or putting it behind the keyboard or putting it on a shelf under the keyboard to minimise the chance of impact or spills. Personally I like to be able to look at the screen to check the host is responding and am prepared to accept the risk (low, but not zero) that a punter may knock my keyboard and laptop over. Most WW's gig in less than ideal circumstances, my band included, so risk minimisation has to be taken into account but can be managed and need not be a deal breaker.
Cheers
Mark
.
________________________________
From: Bruce Wahler
To: CloneWheel@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 3:52 AM
Subject: Re: [CWSG] Re: V-Machines that didn't work for me,
Mark,
We're getting way off track here ...
I never said that a laptop isn't viable as a performance tool. A laptop
has pros and cons for music performance, like other options. However, a
gig-ready laptop is not a perfect opportunity that the big PC
manufacturers fail to see -- it's a niche product, appealing to a small
percentage of the laptop market. For now, gigging with a laptop is
something of a 'roll your own' project to get it configured. If nothing
else, one must take the time to remove or disable the unnecessary items
that get bundled with the average consumer laptop, which might affect
on-stage performance.
My vision of a 'gigging laptop' would be a device pre-configured for
musicians' needs -- i.e., not gaming or office productivity -- which
runs nearly all available VSTs without needing a sequencer shell like
Cubase or Cakewalk, can run several of them at once (for multitimbral
performance), and is rugged enough to be accidentally dropped to the
floor in mid-gig. The big computer players aren't interested in that
level of unique product customization and support. The V-Machine was an
attempt to provide such a product, but stumbled under the weight of all
the VST variations and installation issues -- not to mention the
difficulty of balancing the selling cost against the feature set. Maybe
the next product will be better?
And please understand that I'm not a technophobe: I designed desktops
and laptops for three different Fortune 500 companies over a period of
11 years. I still own two desktops and three laptops, not counting the
ones my wife and son own. I think that you have been fortunate to not
have problems with your HDD-based system, if you gig a lot. I can't
speak for the places where you play, but the clubs I work in are chaotic
at times. and things fall over a lot. My son's laptop nearly
disintegrated in four years of normal college use, including two trips
back to HP for repairs. None of my musical gear can lay claim to that
short a life expectancy. That's the main reason why I don't consider
using VSTs in my live rig.
Regards,
-BW
Bruce Wahler
Ashby Solutions.com^(TM)
bw@ashbysolutions.com
http://music.ashbysolutions.com
877.55.ASHBY (877.552.7429)
On 4/22/2012 8:47 AM, mark k wrote:
>
> Hi Bruce
>
> >>To make a laptop 'player ready,' it needs an SSD, a more rugged
> display, and some kind of mouse-like device that's easier to use
> than a touchpad.
>
> Other recent post have included reference to laptop stands that
> include a mouse holder. I also use one. I use the mouse twice at a
> gig, once to to load Cantabile and once to close it down. All other
> VST controls e.g. drawbars, Leslie control, overdrive etc in in VB3,