From tonysounds@yahoo.com Thu Mar 11 04:45:54 2004
Subject:RE: Pro 145 vs Leslie 21
I dont know how they sound yet, that's why I want to take it to a gig. My engineer friend was just commenting on the way it sounded right there in my practice studio. But it was he who suggested that live it would be very good. Live is where I'd make the judgement call. I do have a problem sacrificing my own listening/playing experience for ease of use, but for those occassions where a leslie is just impractical.... What I'd do is just bring it and not say anything and let the engineer tell me what his opinion is.
T
Robert Baker wrote:
Did your sound guy put the 145 through his sound system? How do the
internal mics sound through a PA?
Bob Baker
-----Original Message-----
From: tonysounds [mailto:tonysounds@yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 10:13 PM
To: CloneWheel@yahoogroups.com
Cc: NordElectro@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [CWSG] Pro 145 vs Leslie 21
A couple more tidbits about the Pro-145 and Leslie 21. I played my
Electro through the Pro 145 for a live engineer friend of mine who was
instantly very excited by it. He's a very good sound engineer and tech
from Poland who handles a large theatre here in Chicago and goes on the
road constantly with European acts who come through Chicago...he mixes
them here and they end up stealing him for the rest of their US stay.
He doesn't buy into most of the mystic bunk that a lot of us do, and has
regularly ticked off audiophiles who gush over $3k speaker cables by
putting them through blind tests where they can't hear the difference
between their cables and his $8.99 cables.
In other words, he just LISTENS and lets his ears be the judge.
He was very enthused about the Pro145. He, like me, was very excited by
the small size, and quite impressed with the sound that came out. And
when he said "it sounds like a real leslie!", I couldn't help myself.
I've been working with this thing the last two days, and it is sitting
next to the Electro on top of one of my Yorkville combos. But on top of
that is my Speakeasy going into my fullsize 122. I turned to him and
said, "you think so?" And unplugged from the Pro145 and plugged into
the Speakeasy. Well, needless to say there was a little spanking going
on.
But his words made a lot of sense, and keep in mind, he listened for 5
minutes, and did a once-around the amp. He said "Tony, there is no
doubt for you or the guy playing this, that the leslie is awesome. It
has much better bass, and fuller sound. But for the guy mixing the
band, it is not so awesome. He has to make everything fit together, and
to make that work, if he is good, he does it by reducing frequencies
rather than adding them, in most cases. So his job will be to make the
organ fit with the band. That means he will roll off some bass to stay
out of the bassist's way, and roll off a little highs to stay out of the
singers' way, and many times, what you hear might not sound pretty by
itself, but it fits beautifully in the context of the music. And you
have no idea what the audience hears anyway. So what does it matter if
you are making the same sound with a small 50lb box or a big 150 lb box?
Why make extra work? And look: this has 3 microphone outputs already?
This
is beautiful. How much?" When I told him around $1799 he was not so
happy. (He owns a lot of backline equipment and was warming up to this
for a moment.) "Hmm, that is lot of money. But still, look how easy it
makes your life." That Steve is a wise man.
Now, I finally got to talk with Hammond Suzuki techs to verify some info
I couldn't get myself. The line outs on the top unit are not
"microphoned" outputs like the Pro 145. They are dry un-effected
outputs. But the low rotor sim is built into the 2101 (top unit), so
feeding the "low out" to your combo or bass amp will yield the desired
results. So you would still need to mic the Leslie 21. Also,
daisychaining them to a 6pin 122 is not something you can do unless you
have a knowledgeable Hammond/Leslie who can make something for you to do
that. They have no kits that will allow it. But if you have an 11pin
organ or clone, you can make an 11pin Y adaptor that will allow you to
daisy chain a 2101 to your 147 or other 11pin leslie. The bottom unit
is biamped, and in theory would work as good keyboard combo (it has a
12" and horn). So you could plug your clone into the top unit (which
will feed the bottom unit) and your other keyboard into the bottom unit
alone and still have full
range tone on both boards. Not bad.
So, as I said before, depending on your needs, you could be pretty happy
with either of these amplifiers. I'd like to try the Pro145 on a gig to
see how it sounded in context on stage, and how it sounded in the
audience through the PA. Those factors aside, the Leslie 21 sounded
better to me, but if my friend Steve is right, and engineers are
deducting from my signal, I could see that in many respects, for me
this might actually be the better way to go. I almost always use a real
leslie, and for those really rare occassions I don't, it's space and
time issues that prevent me from using it. The Pro145 presents a real
palatable solution with its small size, all-in-one design, and XLR outs.
Hmmm...Electro in one hand, Pro 145 in the other...well, maybe more like
Electro on top of Pro 145 wheeling into the gig.
Hope this helped rather than confused.
Tone Nay Nay
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