From groovecake@yahoo.com Thu Sep 05 12:32:16 2002
Subject:Re: A Better Clone? - In praise of the B4

I don't think I need a merge box since the VK-7 allows
midi-thru info. I haven't tried it yet but I think
that should work just fine.

Regarding the Rotary Speed switches...my solution is a
bit of a drag but my style allows me to do the
following:

I set up the 1 ft. drawbar to control the Leslie and
the 1 1/3 ft. bar to control the 1 ft. bar. (The 1 ft.
drawbar is the only one I will usually mess with
during performance.)

Why?

Because I am not one of those players who is always
changing drawbars settings in the middle of solos and
all that. You don't hear Jimmy Smith or Joey D. or
Chester Thompson doing that much. (When you are
kicking left hand bass, you really don't have much
opportunity to tweak drawbars). They usually bounce
between a couple pre-sets.

I am way more attracted to their style than the
Medeski-types who are always changing the drawbar
settings. Therefore, I really don't need each drawbar
assigned to its respective midi channel because I
really don't use them that much.

When playing jazz trio on the B-3, I go between the Bb
and B presets, with the respective drawbar settings
being 888888888 and 888000000 with percussion. I have
these presets set in the memory of the B4 and switch
between them using program changes on the VK-7. Not
only is this easier, it's more realistic than grabbing
all the freaking drawbars and clicking off the
percussion. I don't do it on a real B-3, so why would
I do it on the B4?

I guess that's why two sets of drawbars on the CX-3
wasn't much of a selling point for me. I really don't
need it.

Regarding chorus and percussion, same thing. I have
presets with and without chorus for the 888000000,
888000008, and 888888888 settings.

If you are a "drawbar grabber" and such, then this
might be an issue for you. Since I am not, I have
solved the problem with presets.

(Plus, if I am in a situation where I am running
through a real Leslie, I can activate all the drawbars
with a simple change of a midi channel.)

Ok...I'm done rambling.

Mitch

--- ViGi wrote:
> Mitch,
>
> how do you switch the rotary speed on the b4 via vk7
> since the leslie switch uses system exclusive
> messages?
> So does the chorus I think and percussion as well?
> the best solution for native instruments would be to
> make a hardware version of it with the wood too for
> the art lovers!
>
> Roger
>
> P.S. : BTW use a merger so you can use two manuals!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: M T
> To: CloneWheel@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 8:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [CWSG] A Better Clone? - In praise of
> the B4
>
> Paul,
>
> Wow...you sound like my twin (at least as far as
> your
> feelings about the VK-7).
>
> I have been an adamant VK-7 user for a few years.
> Like
> you, I play jazz and am well aware of the
> shortcomings
> of the VK-7 in the jazz setting (shrill high end,
> chorus not quite right, etc.)
>
> Just last week...I saw the light. And, it sounds
> like
> you are seeing it too.
>
> What did I do? I got the B4 software.
>
> I'll put it this way - if the CX-3 would have
> sounded
> this good, I'd have bought it right on the spot.
> But
> it doesn't. Nothing else on the market sounds like
> the
> B4.
>
> The B4 is the most realistic B-3 this side of a
> B-3.
> They got it right. In the first few days of
> running it
> through it's paces, I would sometimes have to stop
> playing and just yell, "Damn!!" The programming is
> so
> flexible - you can have pretty much any organ you
> want.
>
> If I were you, I'd forget the V5 or the Electro or
> the
> new Key 5 and buy a decent laptop and an external
> USB
> driver (I use the MIDIMAN Quattro). I am running
> my B4
> with my Vk-7 - very handy since the drawbars send
> MIDI
> info.
>
> Factor in the $$ for the laptop and the external
> USB
> and you are still less than a new Korg CX-3.
>
> I really don't know why more people don't do this.
> I
> suppose I questioned the wisdom of the whole
> "gigging
> with a laptop" thing...until I played the B4. I am
> a
> convert.
>
> (And thanks to the guys on the list (Steve, Paul
> and
> Deke) who gave me advice before my purchase.)
>
> Mitch
>
> --- Quadrant wrote:
> > I'd like to ask for opinions on buying some gear
> -
> > let me take a moment to explain my
> predicament...
> >
> > I play jazz using a VK-7 with a motion sound
> KBRM.
> > I've found this combination to be fantastic in
> most
> > situations - the motion sound is at it's most
> > characteristic when the horn is spinning and
> it's
> > being driven quite loud - and until recently
> I've
> > been happy with the VK-7 side of the equation as
> > well. Recently I got the 17 note fatar pedals
> and
> > this also added a dimension to the 'hammond'
> > experience - I've enjoyed learning how to 'kick'
> and
> > use my foot for ballads. Having every limb
> involved
> > in the music feels great!
> >
> > The problem is that as I have been gigging a lot
> > lately, I've become 'attuned' to weaknesses that
> I
> > hear in the VK-7's sound. The first of these is
> the
> > scanner chorus emulation, particularly on C3.
> From
> > what I have read and hears it seems that almost
> > every clone made since the VK-7 does a better
> job of
> > this. This concerns me because the chorus sound
> is
> > an essential part of the jazz sound. The second
> is
> > the harsh quality of the upper drawbars. This is
> > weird because I've always been knocked back by
> how
> > rich and full the bottom end of the instrument
> > sounds. Lastly, the key click leaves a lot to be
> > desired, and I'm beginning to realise how
> essential
> > this is to the feel of fast right hand lines
> > (especially when using the 888000000 with perc
> > setting).
> >
> > Today I did an experiment. As well as the KBRM I
> > have at home a Yamaha RA100 cabinet, which,
> although
> > not a leslie, contains two spinning horns
> (actually
> > two spinning speakers!), and a 15" woofer and it
> > sounds amazing for organ. I plugged the VK into
> this
> > and played around for a while - sounds nice...
> > ...and then I did the following... I set up the
> VK
> > to control the B4 on my PC, set the leslie sim
> off
> > on the B4 and took the output into the yamaha
> amp. I
> > played around with this setup for a while, and
> this
> > sounded a lot better than the VK did. Even
> though
> > the sound was generated by some software running
> on
> > windows and coming out of a soundcard, the sound
> was
> > warmer and more characterful than that of the
> VK!
> > With this setup I found myself playing a lot
> more
> > inspired stuff.
> >
> > So.... ...I feel I can do something to improve
> the
> > playing experience I am having. But what??? I've
> > been considering two options. (I ruled out the
> CX-3
> > because I've gotten used to playing pedals -
> shame
> > on you, Korg).
> >
> > 1) Get a Voce V5. I'd like to try one but as far
> as
> > I know there is only one shop in the entire UK
> which
> > stocks them which is Turnkey in London - 400
> miles
> > away! I've heard a couple of mp3s of the V5 here
> and
> > there but I can't find any more around. Does
> anybody
> > have any, or know any recordings of the Voce?
> From
> > what I've read, If I went this route I'd have to
> get
> > a midi merge box (again, punished because I play
> > pedals!) and an audio pass-through type volume
> pedal
> > (damn - I love my yamaha FC-7). Is this true?
> >
>
=== message truncated ===

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